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Discussion Starter #1
Ouch....So much for VW's estimate of mid 50s.

The 2009 Volkswagen Jetta TDI is coming to VW dealers this summer as the first of the new batch of 50 state clean diesels and the official EPA fuel economy numbers are now out. The diesel has come in with ratings of 30mpg on the urban cycle and 41mpg on the highway cycle. Those numbers are a bit lower than expected, with Volkswagen having implied previously implied that 40mpg both city and highway were possible. More recently they have indicated that real world highway figures of up to 60mpg were possible.

Regardless of the expectations we might have had, these numbers are a huge improvement over the current 2.5L five cylinder and 2.0L turbo offerings. The 34mpg combined figure is a 41.7 percent improvement over the 2.5L and 36 percent boost over the 2.0L. The Prius is rated at 48/45mpg city/highway. We'll be looking forward to our chance to evaluate a new Jetta TDI to see how it does in the real world.

Update: We just talked to VW spokesman Keith Price about the EPA numbers and his response was that the VW TDIs typically do better in real world mileage performance than the official ratings. We'll reserve judgement until we get our hands on one in late June.
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/05/21/officially-official-epa-rates-2009-jetta-tdi-at-30-41mpg/
 

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1. Engines were not broken in.
2. Previous TDIs mostly got higher than EPA ratings
3. The new test produces numbers that are probably the absolute worst minimum numbers instead of realistic numbers.
4. The tester had Krispy Kremes the morning of the test?
 

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Another EPA test article from automobile mag

http://www.automobilemag.com/features/news/0805_2009_volkswagen_jetta_tdi_fuel_economy/index.html

The EPA numbers are in for Volkswagen's 2009 Jetta TDI. Although the new diesels get good fuel economy, their official numbers fall short of VW's original estimates.
Early press materials for the new TDI motor claimed that, in Jetta form, the motor could return city mileage "in the mid 40s" and highway figures as high as 60 mpg. But newly released EPA figures (available online at www.fueleconomy.gov) say otherwise.
Jetta and Jetta SportWagons equipped with the 2.0-liter turbodiesel I-4 and a six-speed manual are EPA rated at 30 mpg city; 41 mpg highway. Opt for a six-speed DSG and the numbers drop to 29 mpg city, 40 mpg highway.
Those figures are approximately forty percent lower than VW's rough estimates, although the automaker maintains customers could see results higher than the EPA's numbers in real world driving. Even so, 30/41 is still respectable, particularly for the SportWagon - a Smart fortwo improves city mileage by only 3 mpg and returns an identical highway figure.
 

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That sucks. 50 mpg is the magic number that people need to hear. Otherwise, they'll just see $4/gallon gas er...diesel...and get turned off.
 

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They must realize that their primary competitors are not the honda civics but the toyota priuses. They are fighting an uphill battle since prius has the green image and diesels have a dirty image. Unless they can get people to pay attention, they aren't going to get people to drive the cars, buy the cars, and get the public to change their minds. They will alwys have a small band of loyalists but they've lost the first battle IMO. They should be preparing a big advertising campaign unless they want the market to catch up from Honda, Acura, Nissan, Subaru diesels to come.
 

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2nd, underpromise and overdeliver. They were hyping 60 mpg, I heard someone say "Don't diesels get 70 mpg?" The EPA rating was a big disappointmet.
 

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I prefer the VW look over the Honda look but if the Honda diesel is a better driver and gets better mileage, they get my vote.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Dealer invoice price on the jetta sport wagon is 22,241 on the manual, 23340 on the DSG. They're only making about $1300 at MSRP, not including any dealer extra costs or kickbacks, or added options.
 

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I'm sure profit on a Mercedes Benz is a lot higher than on a VW. Some dealers also get dealer incentives where they get money back on each car from the factory if they pass a certain sales rate.
 

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What ticks me off is that dealer profit =/= dealer service. Some places, once you get the car, you're on your own. A $25,000 VW is still pretty expensive regardless of how much the dealer makes.
 

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An outside firm was hired to re-test the VW in real world driving...and only got 38/44 highway...disappointing.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=127427

HERNDON, Virginia — Volkswagen of America said the 2009 Jetta TDI sedan will start at $21,990, while the 2009 Jetta SportWagen TDI will be priced from $23,590. Both models go on sale in August and are rated by the EPA at 29 mpg in city driving and 40 mpg on the highway.

The TDI's clean diesel meets stringent emissions standards in all 50 states. But diesel advocates had expected much higher EPA mileage ratings on the VW turbodiesel, due in part to the automaker's own aggressive positioning. On its Web site, VW says the TDI engine has "an anticipated fuel efficiency of mid-50s highway (and) mid-40s city."

But even the company's own testing, conducted by an outside firm, fell well short of that mark.

In part to blunt some of the negative feedback generated by the lower-than-expected EPA numbers, VW hired a third-party company, AMCI, to conduct what it calls "real-world testing" on the '09 Jetta TDI. The automaker said the AMCI tests showed the TDI achieved significantly better results — 38 mpg in the city and 44 on the highway — than the official EPA ratings.

What this means to you: VW takes some of the sting out of high fuel prices — and steep new-car stickers. But diesel aficionados who expected to rack up huge mileage gains may be disappointed both by the EPA figures and their own real-world driving experience in the new TDI.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Well what do you expect? It's a bigger, more powerful car. It's pretty unlikely to have a big leap forward in mileage and mileage isn't everything. Mileage and power will probably go up after a few thousand miles are put on the car too.
 

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Honestly, I wonder how mileage would change if you tore off the emissions filters. Put a downpipe on it, cut out the EGR system, and put a straight pipe to replace the cats.
 

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I was reading on another forum the case of the ford powerstrokes. They were able to increase mileage by 40% by ripping out emissions...of course you have to take that with a grain of salt because they might be towing stuff, hauling stuff, exaggerating numbers, etc., but I'm sure it's only a matter of time before the emissions filters come off.
 
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