[biochris]

Hello,

This is my introduction. After a couple years of driving the slowest vehicle ever made (a stock 82 diesel vanagon on 100% biodiesel year round) and the addition of a baby I broke down and bought a TDI family wagon. I have driven, abused, and worked on air-cooled vdubs and vanagon's my whole life but love the simplicity and durability of the vw diesels. In this part of the country TDI's go for at least 30% more than the rest of the country because of the bio-craze. Long story short, I found a jetta tdi wagon for about 4 times less than comparable tdi's I had looked at. The catch: it was a former pharmaceutical delivery vehicle and has 503,000 miles, yes five-hundred thousand miles on it. I bought from a sort of sketchy dude with basically no paperwork but the car was in such good shape I couldn't say no. I compression tested it and all cylinders are around 500 psi and doesn't noticeably burn or leak oil. It currently runs and drives great. It starts when it is 30 degrees out even though I haven't got the glow plugs to work yet. I put new glow plugs in (3 of the 4 were burned out) and have a load of parts in the mail and just got my Bentley today.

My short list of things to fix before I hand it over to the wife to drive ( I ride my bike to work):
-Heavy smoke on cold startup (glow plug light doesn't come on) no power at glow plugs. No visible smoke once it warms up. I bought a $7 coolant temp sensor was gonna switch it out.
-goes into limp mode accelerating hard uphill. ( i assume I should clean my intake before going on a wild goose chase replacing sensors, MAF's etc)
-speedometer needle light doesn't work
-climate control light is burned out
-inside door handle is broken.
-I only have one key and am somewhat baffled at the exorbitant cost/difficulty of a replacement. Would greatly appreciate advice on how to get this done without maxing out the credit card.
- I need to install a skid plate and/or steel oil pan (terrible design in my opinion)
- got relay 109 on the way

My super sweet harbor freight code reader just broke when I was trying to pull the codes so I was debating about downloading the free or lite version of the VCDS and hooking up the cord to the laptop. I'm new to these fancy computer controlled cars so I have learning curve on all this sensor computer stuff. This is a great forum and have found the info on here to be immensely helpful so far.

Any opinions, advice, or threats are welcome.

 

[chittychittybangbang]

You win the prize for most miles! The prize is lots of free repair advice!!!

A common problem is bad glow plug wiring harness. No GP light could mean a nmber of things, I would definitely get the codes scanned. If you plan on doing lots more DIY work I would invest in a ross tech VCDS tool. The software license follows the cable so after depreciation if you decide to sell it later is really a better value than buying a generic cable and buying a software license. It's way more than a code scanner.

The smoke could also be worn nozzles, they are definitely worn out. Take a look in the FAQ on how to replace and some background info on them.

On fixing limp mode, yes, but also check codes before throwing parts at it. Most common problems are vac lines. With that many miles I would just replace them all. There are more common problems like sticking actuators and sticking turbos that are explained in the FAQ.

There should be a note in the FAQ but climate control light is behind the center knob. Just pull it out.

There's a FAQ article on how to take apart the door which should give you an idea of what's inside the door on how to fix the door handle.

Look through the mk4 key FAQ on how to get key cheapest. Absolute cheapest if you already have VCDS is to get vag tacho, pull the SKC, buy cut key online, and DIY. If you don't have the tools, buy cut key online and take to dealer for 1 hour labor.

Also, that's why you have to love a diesel. Still great compression after all those miles! A top notch TDI can have 550 psi compression but the new engine spec is only around 450.

welcometomyturbodies

 

[biochris]

Just to clarify, are you suggesting I get the " License with HEX-USB+CAN Interface" below for $349. Does the "lite" version not have enough functionality for DIY on the TDI? I already have a cable from my POS harbor freight reader I could use with an adapter. My parents have 2009 tdi wagon so it would be get to software that would work for both cars Thanks for the advice!

VCDS Ultra Professional Kit $1,199.00 In Stock
VCDS Super Professional Kit $899.00 In Stock
VCDS Professional Kit - USB Interface $599.00 In Stock
VCDS Professional Kit - Serial Interface $599.00 In Stock
VCDS License with HEX-USB+CAN Interface $349.00 In Stock
VCDS License with HEX-COM+CAN Interface $329.00 In Stock
VCDS License with Micro-CAN Interface $249.00 In Stock
VCDS License with KII-USB Interface $249.00 In Stock
VAS 5051/2 "2x2" Adapter for Older Cars $50.00 In Stock
VCDS-Lite Software Registration $99.00

 

[Fluid]

If you want a cable that will work on both cars you should get that one. If not the KII will work on only your car. The Micro-Can will work only on their car.

 

[chittychittybangbang]

To be honest I'm not sure what lite includes. Maybe someone from ross tech can chime in here?

I do know that lite is designed for use with ebay cables or other 3rd party interfaces and can only be used on 1 computer with 1 change ever. The way I see it, buy the genuine full cable and when you're done, sell it for a $50 discount. The software license follows the cable. I think only the first owner will get full tech support from directly from ross tech but they are often on the forums. If you buy the lite software license, you get to use a lower functionality cable and when you're done you have a product with no resale value.

From their page:
"VCDS-Lite registrations are not transferable. You can sell your interface, but you cannot sell or transfer your license. If you sell the PC on which you've got it licensed, your buyer will be able to use the full version of the software, but your buyer will not be eligible for any kind of support from Ross-Tech."

 

[Keithuk]

Welcome to the forum. welcometomyturbodies

I read a sale on fleabay the other night.

Hardly used VCDS for £349 you can buy a new one which I've just done for £264. Some people will try to sell anything on there and there are plenty of suckers that will buy it.

Another reason for http://www.myturbodiesel.com/forum/f10/vcds-vag-com-section-here-3918/

 

[biochris]

codes

I haven't got my vcds yet (thanks for the advice) but I finally got my generic code reader to work and got the following

p0684 glow plug
p0234 overboost
p0251 injection pump metering
p0183 fuel temperature

I have tried to poke around on the forum for hints and I'll check the bentley in the meantime but any thoughts?

 

[Vent5]

Overboosting w/limp mode is normally sticking vanes. The turbo doesn't respond like it should so the ECU pulls power to prevent a bigger boom. Fuel temperature might be a bad fuel temp sensor. I remember seeing the writeup in the FAQ if you search. Not sure what that injection pump metering code is but it could be related to bad fuel. Is your fuel contaminated with water?

 

[Keithuk]

I haven't got my vcds yet (thanks for the advice) but I finally got my generic code reader to work and got the following

p0684 glow plug
p0234 overboost
p0251 injection pump metering
p0183 fuel temperature

I have tried to poke around on the forum for hints and I'll check the bentley in the meantime but any thoughts?

EOBD II Error Code: P0684

Fault Location:
Glow plug control module to Engine control module (ECM)/Powertrain control module (PCM) communication error - range/performance problem

Possible Cause:
Wiring.
Poor connection.
Glow plug control module.
Engine control module (ECM)/Powertrain control module (PCM).

EOBD II Error Code: P0234

Fault Location:
Turbocharger (TC), engine boost condition - limit exceeded

Possible Cause:
Hose connection(s).
Wiring.
Turbocharger (TC) wastegate regulating valve.
Turbocharger (TC) wastegate.

EOBD II Error Code: P0251

Fault Location:
Injection pump fuel metering control A, cam/rotor/injector - circuit malfunction

Possible Cause:
Wiring.
Injection pump.
Engine control module (ECM).


VAG Error Code: 16567

EOBD II Error Code: P0183

Fault Location:
Fuel temperature sensor A (G81) - high input

Possible Cause:
Wiring short to positive.
Fuel temperature sensor (G81).
Low ambient temperature operation.
Engine control module (ECM).

As taken from my http://www.myturbodiesel.com/forum/f9/free-eobd-ii-error-codes-software-2919/

 

[biochris]

Thanks for all the input. Looks like I should investigate whether the turbo vanes are sticking. I now remember now that I disconnected the wiring harness to the injection pump when I ran the compression test. That is probably the reason for the last two codes. I cleared the codes so we'll see if they pop up again. My check engine light never came on. Is this normal? If I'm getting no action at all on my glow plugs is the glow plug relay the most common fault? I would just switch it out but is pretty pricey for a relay.

 

[chittychittybangbang]

Bad wiring harness or connections =most common glow plug problem. The relay does die though. Try this: unplug the coolant temp sensor on the dvr side head coolant flange and see if the glow plugs are getting power or if the harness is getting power. No power at harness = bad relay.

 

[biochris]

A follow up to the problems and advice so far:

I replaced my nozzles with Bosio 357's. The writeup was very helpful. I made the mistake of totally disconnecting the injector lines from the injection pump and drained a quart or so of diesel on the garage floor. Never had this problem on the 82 vw. Oh well I got experience priming the injection pump. I soaked around the injectors with pb blaster for a 24 hours, broke the injectors free clockwise, then wiggled and added pb blaster until they came free. It worked great. Cleaning the heads up with a que tip was the worst part of the whole job. The nozzles seemed to noticebly improve acceleration, smooth out idling, and reduce startup smoke and shaking. The holes on the old nozzles were visibly larger than the new nozzles.

It is still running a little smokey, barely visible but you could smell it, especially before reaching operating temperature. I checked the IQ in VCDS and at idle it was 1.8 mg/st at idle. I adjusted this up to the limit of around 4 mg/st and around 36 or 37 at full throttle. Yet to see how well this worked. I don't understand why a larger number results in less fueling like the writeup states. Can somebody explain this?

The glow plug problem was finally resolved by replacing the glow plug relay. I was getting all kinds of crazy voltage readings from 0.5 V to negative 0.3V before that made no sense. Prior to this I replaced the glow plugs and the coolant sensor and checked most of the wiring to no avail. I found a relay for under 80 bucks at one of the large auto parts websites switched it out and the plugs work great. The only issue remaining is that the glow plug light does not come on during preglow even though the plugs are working but will come on if I pull the coolant sensor plug. Any ideas on this?

Also fixed the door handle, the cable had been disconnected.

I have yet to fix the overboost problem but it is only an occaisonal problem. Plan to clean the intake and checkout the turbo as soon as I get some motivation.

Also my MIL light and speedometer/tach needles don't illuminate. Is it possible they are burned out or is it a wiring problem?

Thanks so much for all the great advice so far.

 

[chittychittybangbang]

answers in bold and picture below. Also, post moved to mk4 forum since it's grown quite long and technical.

Yet to see how well this worked. I don't understand why a larger number results in less fueling like the writeup states. Can somebody explain this?
I will edit the article later to help explain this. I believe it's the amount of air. More air per stroke = less fuel per stroke.
The only issue remaining is that the glow plug light does not come on during preglow even though the plugs are working but will come on if I pull the coolant sensor plug. Any ideas on this?

Normally it's a bad coolant sensor. Check coolant temp sensor for ambient when car is cold overnight. It should be the same as air intake temp. Here is how mine looked when warm.

Also my MIL light and speedometer/tach needles don't illuminate. Is it possible they are burned out or is it a wiring problem?
Hm...Those are LED and should never burn out. Wiring or fuse problem.

Thanks so much for all the great advice so far.
no prob, it's a challenge

 

[biochris]

follow up to original thread

A follow up to this thread FWIW:

I got the glow plugs working right. I basically replaced everything and I did the glow plug module last due to cost. Nothing worked until I replaced the module and now the plugs work fine. I'm sure the new glow plug harness and plugs didn't hurt though. I run biodiesel and so I increased my pre-glow time a bit and that seemed to help out quite a bit to get an extra second or so of glow.

I did my timing belt, water pump, coolant flush, and intake cleaning 2 weeks ago. The writeup here is extremely helpful. It turns out the crankshaft was retarded one tooth from the valves and injection pump. Fixed that and advanced my timing slightly and its running smoother and less smokey.

Limp Mode. I've got it to the point where it only goes into limp mode with extended high rpms like a freeeway on ramp and it has trouble getting to 4000 rpms or so. But it doesn't throw codes anymore when it goes in limp mode. My original code was for overboost so when I did the timing belt I tested the actuator and it had a 3/4" or so movement with no stickiness so I think the vanes are OK. I tested the MAF and it is fine. My last guess is a boost leak, N75, or sensor problem. There is also a very occasional problem of it running really smokey and rough randomly when it starts. If I turn the car off and on again it usually gets better.