[2001bug]

Ok . . . new to posting here, and a little new to repairing (well . . .major repairs anyway) my 2001 TDI Beetle. (this is me right here)=> :dunno

For whatever reason, at 70,000 miles, the injection pump has "gone south" . . . it doesn't develop adequate pressure to open the injectors. The lowest replacement cost that I can get from a repair shop is $3000, P&L, which I find "prohibitive." I have plenty of wrenching experience (full engine rebuilds on everything from vintage tractors to many different gas engined autos), but little with this bug. I am attempting to replace the pump myself. I have located a Bosch reconditioned pump for a reasonable price, the related engine blocking tools, and I am ordering the Vag-Com software (and studying it's use). I have read many of the fine threads here about this issue. I have two questions for the obviously very experienced VW "hobbyists" here:

1) Am I crazy to take this on?!? Frankly, the idea of "mastering" this little car intrigues me, which gives me some "incentive."

2) All the info that I can find, including posts here and the factory service manual that I have purchased from the Vee-dub dealer (which I find pert nearly worthless), says that I should "Never, Never disturb the nut on the pump hub" (on the "keyless tapered shaft" that has a woodruff key slot and no key . . . go figure) because this is set up for the basic timing of the pump, and the fine tuning is taken up by the three slotted bolts. BUT . . . and hear's the "rub" . . . the new pump appears to come "sans nut and hub." SO . . . How does one establish the basic timing of the hub to the pump on a new pump? (which I assume would put the pump timing slots approximately in the middle of the necessary timing span to allow fine tuning).

Perhaps I don't understand this at all . . . so commentary from any one much wiser on this issue than I would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

 

[chittychittybangbang]

1. No, an injection pump swap is relatively simple. It's just a few steps beyond doing a timing belt. $3000 is definitely too expensive.

Bosch reconditioned pump from WHO? There's a diffference between a real Bosch reconditioned pump with warranty, that has been calibrated with all of the expensive Bosch calibration equpiment. If it's just someone who put on new seals, then it's not a reconditioned pump. If it's the guy on ebay who sells dirt cheap made in China counterfeit products, then you are getting ripped off.

2. Yes, never disturb the pump hub. The SPROCKET (the thing that looks like a gear) can come off. The HUB (the thing that the sprocket bolts onto) cannot come off. If the new pump doesn't come with that grey hub correctly indexed then it's potentially useless. A true Bosch reconditioning shop can remove and replace it but you cannot. Even the VW dealership doens't have the equipment to index it correctly.

You could get it roughly correct and get the car to run but if you're paying for a new pump, it should have the hub already correctly indexed. A new pump that has it correctly indexed will only allow the injetion pump locking pin to fit in 1 spot. The pump must be taken apart and the drive tang must be aligned with the mark on the "suction side" cover inside. THEN you can insert the locking pin and tighten the 22m nut that holds on the hub. Any small difference can be made up from measuring it with a VCDS. You must have a VCDS (vagcom) to do this. This is currently the best bet. However, I'm guessing that your intetion was to purchase a hub that you can bolt on, not something that required disassembly and further work to use.

See the grey sprocket hub? The nut that holds it on should never be loosened. Otherwise, the hub can spin independant of the shaft since there's no key. The injection pump doesn't know where it should be since with a loose nut, you could rotate the hub with the pin in place and the shaft can be off!

Again, since it's out of the car you could take it apart to roughly index it and then fine tune it's position with a VCDS but that's not what you paid for right? What else did this shop do? Here are some places which have the proper calibration equipment, you can try calling them and talking to them to verify what I've said.

United Diesel Service, Inc.
1903 Penn Mar Avenue
South El Monte, CA 91733
Phone: (626) 579-4832


Diesel Fuel Injection Service
8922 NE Vancouver Way
Portland OR 97211
(503) 235-1947
(888) 285-1213

 

[2001bug]

Thanks for the help!

Chitty -

Thanks much for the information; this was very helpful . . I love this site and the expertise here . . . I must admit that I don't have the new (reconditioned) pump yet, so it may very well come properly indexed with the hub installed. I'll be glad to report the condition when I receive it. I made the claim that it didn't have the hub installed based on photos only, here:

http://www.thedieselstore.com/template/productOutput.php?partNum=M100460414987X&VehNum=1117192

Apparently this is a Bosch authorized rebuild center and the pump does carry a Bosch 12 month warranty . . . . I'll give them a call in the morning to discuss the hub install, etc.

As I said, I am pretty much a "neophyte" to the VW diesel world, other than that I am a proud (?) owner of a 2001 TDI bug. I really do love the car (it is my commuter) when it is running . . . lots of fun to drive and gets great fuel economy!

Thanks again!

 

[chittychittybangbang]

If it doesn't come with the hub installed then return it. Call those two shops listed above and talk to them and also ask them how much it would cost to have your pump rebuilt, and what your pump's problem might have been.

Maybe the fuel filter was clogged and wasn't allowing any fuel in? Maybe the fuel pickup in the tank had black algae growing on it and clogging the system?

 

[2001bug]

fuel lines and filter tested ok

"Maybe the fuel filter was clogged and wasn't allowing any fuel in? Maybe the fuel pickup in the tank had black algae growing on it and clogging the system?"

I had a shop check this (the guy has about 30 years VW diesel only experience and seemed to know what he is talking about) . . . the filter was replaced (the "old" one wasn't too bad) and the pump was "vacuumed" to draw in fuel without any difficulty . . .

Also, doing the VW service manual recommended "pump test" (where you break the nuts loose on the lines and look for fuel "spurts") the pump does pump copious amounts of fuel . . . I don't think it is the injectors because they all quit at the same time. The pump pumps, but just doesn't seem to build enough pressure to open the injectors.

The "30 year" guy came to the conclusion that it was a worn pump (but also admitted that they rarely go bad during the life of the car) . . . It's a "poser!?!"

 

[2001bug]

Follow up: The pump has the hub

Chitty -

Thanks again for the excellent feedback . . . I called the supplier of the pump and they verified that it does indeed come with the hub installed and correctly indexed. They advertise the pump with a photo that does not have the hub, and indicated that they would update the photo.

I'll report back on the replacement once it is complete.

Thanks again!

 

[DirtyTrix]

Chitty -

Thanks again for the excellent feedback . . . I called the supplier of the pump and they verified that it does indeed come with the hub installed and correctly indexed. They advertise the pump with a photo that does not have the hub, and indicated that they would update the photo.

I'll report back on the replacement once it is complete.

Thanks again!

The bug is a little different but you should be able to figure it out! :thumbsup Always good to read a happy story!

 

[Vent5]

Wow, what a story! FYI, make sure to prime the pump before starting it. There's probably some lube inside but you really want as much diesel in there to help the car start fast. And the pump is lubed by the fuel.

 

[jimlindsay]

fuel Injection pump

Hell I'm new to this forum and in need of help. I have a 2002 Jetta TDI 199,000K Runs like a watch until the o-ring started leaking at the rear of the pump. I removed the the rear of the pump and found about 25 parts and had to put the puzzle together. I got the cam 180% off and it started but ran very bad. So I disassembled again turned the cam 180% and started very easily but smoked. My question is where can I find a diagram of how to set the cam and assemembly in the rear of the pump? I did not remove the pump from the car or move the timing belt. I did fix my fuel leak if I can just get the timing correct.
Thanks Jim [email protected]

 

[chittychittybangbang]

Did you remove the quantity adjuster? If so, you need VCDS to set the timing.

Does it otherwise run and rev OK? I have some stuff but it's not yet finished so here are some videos to get you started.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VR44StvcXms

 

[ZoomALH]

Is this any help? http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/renaultip.htm I don't know why chitty didn't post it but it looks like it's about the same.

 

[gasousman]

Living and Learning

Thank God you put these videos on here. I'm replacing my rear pump seal and before seeing these videos I was hoping to back the head out and slip the o-ring on. Whew, what a mistake that may have been. I just replaced the top cap seal and because I didn't have the special socket I gently banged, if that's possible, a 1/4 inch socket on the head of that special bolt. It's my guess I created a second leak due to the seals being so brittle. It was a risk I had to take. I've been planning on removing the intake so I can clean it over this long holiday weekend and now this. I need my Jetta Monday so I can return to work and now I have to start desperately looking for the seal kit. Not only do I have to find the seal kit, which I almost ordered instead of the single top cap seal I ordered the other day, I also have to buy VAG-COM and that special socket. Does anyone know where the best price for VAG_COM will be? I found good VAG-COM links in this forum, I just need to make sure I get the best price available. Thanks again for posting these great videos.

 

[gasousman]

Vagcom

I just went to Ross Tech and they want $350 for the VAGCOM software and interface cable. I also noticed on the the Ross Tech website they listed my specific car as not supporting something called "Diesel Pump" (item 41) http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/cars/applications/golfjetta.html. I would be really surprised to pay all that money and then be unable to adjust the QA. I'll send them an email for sure. There has to be an easier way to replace a seal or two. Does anyone know if replacing my pump with a used one will require the use of VAGCOM?

 

[chittychittybangbang]

I just went to Ross Tech and they want $350 for the VAGCOM software and interface cable. I also noticed on the the Ross Tech website they listed my specific car as not supporting something called "Diesel Pump" (item 41) http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/cars/applications/golfjetta.html. I would be really surprised to pay all that money and then be unable to adjust the QA. I'll send them an email for sure. There has to be an easier way to replace a seal or two. Does anyone know if replacing my pump with a used one will require the use of VAGCOM?

It does support your car. I've used it.

 

[gasousman]

Thanks Chitty. For the first time in twenty five years I'm considering taking my car to someone else. Maybe I can find someone with a VAGCOM opposed to shelling out all that doe for my own.