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Premium Member
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32 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
All,
I have a 2004 BEW 5 speed Jetta Wagon. I has about 260K on the ticker.
I have had it for about a year and it have put about 20K on it myself. Most all maintenance is up to date. Gonna need a basic service soon.

Here is what happened this morning. I went out to head to work. Usual Monday morning.

1. I tried to start the engine. It started. DRL's came on. I slide it into REV and the engine dies.

2. Crank it again. It starts. Start to let the clutch out it dies.

3. Think I might need to glow. Maybe? Temp in upper 40s to lower 50s and haven't started since Thursday afternoon when I got home from work. Turn on key. Notice no glow light. Look a little closer and don't have any indicator lights except battery. I didn't even have a odometer or clock in dash. I go ahead and give it a crank it starts and dies in about 3 seconds.

4. Will continue to crank with no start after this. Had to push out of the way of the wife's beetle and even with the key on the windows would not roll down.

I didn't have time to check anything. My thoughts in order are:

Ignition switch not making ignition circuit. Maybe a fuse, but shouldn't I have a odometer? Might have been to dark to see it this morning.

No power to ECM/PCM "brain", but would it crank?

Mystery open fuse link?

Let me know your thoughts?

Headed home to check on the waggy. Got an hour to think about it. Don't know if VCDS will tell me anything if no ECM/PCM power from ignition.

Thanks,
Frank
 

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Discussion Starter #2
When I got home yesterday. No clock or odometer on the dash. VCDS will not communicate with any module except ABS. I had to turn off key for it to try the airbag module still no comm with airbag. My whole scan report.

Monday,22,April,2019,19:02:57:38116
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 7 x64
VCDS Version: 18.9.1.0 (x64)
Data version: 20190114 DS296.0
www.Ross-Tech.com


Chassis Type: 9M - VW Jetta IV (1998 > 2014)
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 15 16 17 19 22 29 35 36 37 39 46 47 55 56 57
75 76

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ABS.lbl
Part No: 1C0 907 379 L
Component: ABS FRONT MK60 0101
Coding: 0001025
Shop #: WSC 01266 785 00200
VCID: 336F2C8A51A18CD210-5122
No fault code found.
End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 07:38)--------------------------


The fuse links on top of battery all look and check good. 12.5 VDC on battery. Can't find my power probe so I'm going with multi-meter to fuse panel. All looks good in there.

Any suggestions?
 

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9,339 Posts
I assume this is on your Jetta or Beetle, you need to state this in the thread.

That isn't a full AutoScan, you need to post the full log file in Code tags.

Do you have the correct fuse and relay layout?

Fuse & Relay PDF Files
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I assume this is on your Jetta or Beetle, you need to state this in the thread.

That isn't a full AutoScan, you need to post the full log file in Code tags.

Do you have the correct fuse and relay layout?

Fuse & Relay PDF Files
Not sure where else to post it other than the very first sentence of the first post.

"All,
I have a 2004 BEW 5 speed Jetta Wagon. I has about 260K on the ticker."

That is the full auto scan. It would attempt to read each module 3 times. Then move on, and yes the key was on. It doesn't take
"-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 07:38)--------------------------"
to scan just the ABS module it takes about 30 seconds for each module.

Thank you for the Fuse and Relay PDF Files.

Does anyone other than a Super Moderator have any input?
 

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31 Posts
All,
I have a 2004 BEW 5 speed Jetta Wagon. I has about 260K on the ticker.
I have had it for about a year and it have put about 20K on it myself. Most all maintenance is up to date. Gonna need a basic service soon.

Here is what happened this morning. I went out to head to work. Usual Monday morning.

1. I tried to start the engine. It started. DRL's came on. I slide it into REV and the engine dies.

2. Crank it again. It starts. Start to let the clutch out it dies.

3. Think I might need to glow. Maybe? Temp in upper 40s to lower 50s and haven't started since Thursday afternoon when I got home from work. Turn on key. Notice no glow light. Look a little closer and don't have any indicator lights except battery. I didn't even have a odometer or clock in dash. I go ahead and give it a crank it starts and dies in about 3 seconds.

4. Will continue to crank with no start after this. Had to push out of the way of the wife's beetle and even with the key on the windows would not roll down.

I didn't have time to check anything. My thoughts in order are:

Ignition switch not making ignition circuit. Maybe a fuse, but shouldn't I have a odometer? Might have been to dark to see it this morning.

No power to ECM/PCM "brain", but would it crank?

Mystery open fuse link?

Let me know your thoughts?

Headed home to check on the waggy. Got an hour to think about it. Don't know if VCDS will tell me anything if no ECM/PCM power from ignition.

Thanks,
Frank
sounds like the main computer relay i think...?
 

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Do you have an older autoscan, such that one can see which modules should appear?
And which of the electrical accessories work, which not? Is there a change in between ignition on and off which should not appear?
I would start with the assumption that there is an even single common cause. This could be either on the supply side, or on grounding side.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for your input gentlemen.

The Battery is a solid 12.5 Volts drops to 12.2 when cranking.

sounds like the main computer relay i think...?
I know where the 2 relays are out near the master cylinder. They will not click at any time or position of the ignition. I think the have to do with the glow plugs in the coolant lines. Not to sure though. this is the first MkIV I have worked on in 6 years. Where is the computer relay located?

Do you have an older autoscan, such that one can see which modules should appear?
And which of the electrical accessories work, which not? Is there a change in between ignition on and off which should not appear?
I would start with the assumption that there is an even single common cause. This could be either on the supply side, or on grounding side.
I will have to look I think I scanned the car right after I picked it up. Can't remember right now. I know of the 30 plus scans I have done on various VW's I usually end up with 5 or more.

The accessories that I know are working:
door locks unlock w/ key fob. I didn't try to lock
HVAC
wipers front and rear
DRL
interior lights
hazard lights
headlights and exterior lights
rear power port (used for inverter to run laptop)
With key on. All mini fuses in the drivers side dash panel had power and were good. I didn't check the micros they don't have exposed conductor on the back of housing like the minis.
Starter will crank and crank and crank.

Things that are not working:
windows
odometer
digital clock in dash
tack
all gauges
fuel solenoid.
all modules except ABS

Not sure about the rest will try to update later
 

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Thanks for your input gentlemen.


I know where the 2 relays are out near the master cylinder. They will not click at any time or position of the ignition. I think the have to do with the glow plugs in the coolant lines. Not to sure though. this is the first MkIV I have worked on in 6 years. Where is the computer relay located?
im pretty sure it is on the driver side under dash should say 109 or 601 on it... its may be black or grey (grey is the better one, replace with grey) 357906381A is the part number
 

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battery: voltage is not everything ;-)
my MKIV has only one relay (there are various versions - normally 2 i think) for the glow plugs located under bonnet (hood?) rhs in main fuse box (not the one under dash). culd be a naff glow plug draining the power
 

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Super Moderator
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9,339 Posts
VCDS will not communicate with any module except ABS. I had to turn off key for it to try the airbag module still no comm with airbag. My whole scan report.

Monday,22,April,2019,19:02:57:38116
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 7 x64
VCDS Version: 18.9.1.0 (x64)
Data version: 20190114 DS296.0
www.Ross-Tech.com


Chassis Type: 9M - VW Jetta IV (1998 > 2014)
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 15 16 17 19 22 29 35 36 37 39 46 47 55 56 57
75 76

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ABS.lbl
Part No: 1C0 907 379 L
Component: ABS FRONT MK60 0101
Coding: 0001025
Shop #: WSC 01266 785 00200
VCID: 336F2C8A51A18CD210-5122
No fault code found.
End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 07:38)--------------------------
As I've said that isn't a full AutoScan only ABS Brakes Labels with no fault found.

Is the immobilizer light on in the dash? The engine will start for a couple of seconds then stop.

As said do you have a previous AutoScan you can compare.

On mine it shows:

01-Engine -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
04-Steering Angle -- Status: OK 0000
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: OK 0000
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: Malfunction 0010
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: Malfunction 0010
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
2E-Media Player 3 -- Status: OK 0000
42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: OK 0000
44-Steering Assist -- Status: OK 0000
46-Central Conv. -- Status: OK 0000
52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
56-Radio -- Status: OK 0000
62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: OK 0000
72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000

You need to check out other systems for starting, Engine Speed Sensor (G28)/Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor (G28)

You say your battery is ok as you need a good cranking speed, I think its about 280-300 rpm.
 
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As I've said that isn't a full AutoScan only ABS Brakes Labels with no fault found.

Is the immobilizer light on in the dash? The engine will start for a couple of seconds then stop.
...................................
Believe that's all the auto scan he gets. I'd suspect 109 or some fuses or circuits are bad.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
All,
An update on the 2004 waggy.

Last summer it was in the way. I needed to move it so I could get a spot cleaned out in the garage to park it inside to become the main project. I asked Molly to come out to help me hook the tractor to it to pull it out of the way. I told her to push the clutch in and turn the key on so she could steer. She turned the call all the way and it FIRED RIGHT UP!!!!!! I stood there looking dumbfounded for about a minute. She asked me why I needed her help. I asked her to turn it off and then restart it. IT FIRED RIGHT UP AGAIN!!!!!! I have been driving it since. Knock on wood. I have no idea what happened. All I can say is my memory of the last day I last drove it was very rainy and wet. I didn't try to dive it again for three days. That is when it wouldn't start. I guess something got very wet and dried out over a couple months. Another notice is when I bought it, it had no under engine belly pan. About a month after I started driving her again. I installed a Diesekgeek Panzer Plate with Full Metal Jacket side skirts. The old Waggy is still klicking along 110 miles plus each week day.

Thank you all for the prayers and information.

Stay Safe. Stay Healthy.
Frank
 
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