VW TDI forum, Audi, Porsche, and Chevy Cruze Diesel forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
On my 2005.5 Jetta with worn cam lobes and lifters, I am planning to replace the cam.

Reading the cam removal instructions in the FAQ, it talks about setting the BEW cam to make removal easier, without removing the pump.

Are there specific instructions to accomplish the same for the BRM cam?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,902 Posts
Instructions are the same for any single overhead cam PD engine.

I've tried both removing the tandem pump and not removing the tandem pump. Not removing the pump will make life easier and there'll be less mess from the fuel spill. Diesel fuel eats rubber and asphalt. However, it requires moving the camshaft and crankshaft away from TDC. To answer your question, the camshaft rotates once for every two rotations of the crankshaft so you can't rotate each 90 degrees or you'll find that it'll jamb.

Details and pictures are in the camshaft replacement article: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/camshaft-inspection-replace-VW-TDI.htm but basically, the advanced method of replacing a worn PD TDI camshaft is to:
1. put the engine at TDC. You can remove the fuel injector rockers now or later, doesn't make a difference.
2. Move the camshaft 90 degrees with belt on. The slot is now vertical. You can make a mark on the sprocket showing up, or make some general index mark to get the sprocket back on the same direction. This is not an acceptable final position for the timing belt, it's just to get the belt back on.
3. Remove the timing belt and replace the camshaft.
4. The sprocket has a key so it'll only go on the camshaft 1 way. Note the index mark you made before. Put the timing belt back on.
5. Rotate the engine 90 degrees back to TDC, remove the timing belt, and reinstall it the right way. Unless the timing belt was just changed, I'd also change the timing belt while you're in there. However, it's completely possible to slip the belt off with the motor mount still on.

I'll rewrite that part to make it more clear.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #4 (Edited by Moderator)
...the advanced method of replacing a worn PD TDI camshaft is to:
1. put the engine at TDC. You can remove the fuel injector rockers now or later, doesn't make a difference.
2. Move the camshaft 90 degrees with belt on. The slot is now vertical. You can make a mark on the sprocket showing up, or make some general index mark to get the sprocket back on the same direction. This is not an acceptable final position for the timing belt, it's just to get the belt back on.
3. Remove the timing belt and replace the camshaft.
4. The sprocket has a key so it'll only go on the camshaft 1 way. Note the index mark you made before. Put the timing belt back on.
5. Rotate the engine 90 degrees back to TDC, remove the timing belt, and reinstall it the right way. Unless the timing belt was just changed, I'd also change the timing belt while you're in there. However, it's completely possible to slip the belt off with the motor mount still on.

I'll rewrite that part to make it more clear.

1. You mean removing the fuel injector rockers? Not the injectors themselves?
2. Which direction do I move the camshaft? Clockwise or counterclockwise? Does it matter?

I was planning to follow the directions to replace the cam, get the timing belt back on in its starting position, then perform the TB replacment (along with all the other parts). Get everything back together, let the lifters sit for at least an hour, then break in the cam by running the motor at 2000 rpm, then check the timing with VCDS.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,902 Posts
1. Yes. Injectors are held by retainers and should not be touched. Edited post for wording.

2. I don't think it matters since the serpentine belt isn't on. In addition, it's easier to turn it back to TDC than turn it all the way through. I'll leave that out of the faq because that's my speculation that it doesn't matter. However, the rule of thumb is to turn the engine in the direction it normally turns because it's easier for stuff like the injection pump and alternator. There is no IP and the alt is disconnected. There is no power steering pump on the car either, it uses electric steering.

Yeah, the hour that it takes to replace the camshaft and TB should be enough but it couldn't hurt to wait a little longer. This is to let the lifters bleed down. When you get them they'll be pumped up.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Replaced the cam and performed the TB change. Good thing I started on Thursday night. Took about 18 hours including draining the coolant, oil change, bleeding the brakes and clutch. I was planning on starting Saturday morning. Starting Thursday night, I finished in the middle of Saturday.

The cam replacement went great, followed the instructions posted in the DYI, and the extra instructions to move the cam so the pump did not need to be removed. I had two or three lifters with small holes, and one lifter (right side Cyl #3 (is that exhaust?)) with a pencil size hole.
I finished the cam swap Thursday night, stopped when I overtorqued the cam wheel bolt and it broke. No damage done to the threads of the cam. Ordered a new one from the dealer for $3.50, and bought a steel one for a dollar to hold me until Tuesday.

Finished the cam swap on Friday night, and removed the TB parts so that Saturday morning, I could start fresh, installing the TB.

I rotated the cam tensioner clockwise and set the pointer between the two tabs. rotated the cam several times, and the tensioner did not move.
After starting the car, and running it for 20-30 minutes to break in the cam, I checked the tensioner, the pointer was way to the right of the right most tab.
Does the tensioner move? Or did I not have it tight? If not tight, just reset the tension?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,902 Posts
The pointer is most accurate when the engine is at TDC and the engine is cold. Once it warms up or has a little tug from the valve springs or injectors, it can have a little pressure which causes it to move.

This assumes that the tensinoer tab is correctly in the hole, correctly tensioner, not defective, was tightened clockwise, and everything else is correct. Are you saying the center 18mm camshaft bolt broke? It's pretty tough and you should be using a torque wrench or else it could fail later.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Yes, it was that 18mm bolt that broke. It was only me tightening the bolt, and holding the cam tool. So, the torque wrench did not click, since I was trying to keep the cam from moving with one hand, and pulling on the torque wrench with the other. I was not able to hold the cam still, for the wrench to click. It was late, and I knew better, but did not follow my better judgement (I should have stopped).

For the tensioner, the tab was in the hole, and I tightened it clockwise. I will check tomorrow on a cold motor to see where it is pointing.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
On the cold engine the tensioner pointer almost touching the right most tab. Since it is almost in the open space between the two tabs, I will leave the it alone.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
Instructions are the same for any single overhead cam PD engine.

I've tried both removing the tandem pump and not removing the tandem pump. Not removing the pump will make life easier and there'll be less mess from the fuel spill. Diesel fuel eats rubber and asphalt. However, it requires moving the camshaft and crankshaft away from TDC. To answer your question, the camshaft rotates once for every two rotations of the crankshaft so you can't rotate each 90 degrees or you'll find that it'll jamb.

Details and pictures are in the camshaft replacement article: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/camshaft-inspection-replace-VW-TDI.htm but basically, the advanced method of replacing a worn PD TDI camshaft is to:
1. put the engine at TDC. You can remove the fuel injector rockers now or later, doesn't make a difference.
2. Move the camshaft 90 degrees with belt on. The slot is now vertical. You can make a mark on the sprocket showing up, or make some general index mark to get the sprocket back on the same direction. This is not an acceptable final position for the timing belt, it's just to get the belt back on.
3. Remove the timing belt and replace the camshaft.
4. The sprocket has a key so it'll only go on the camshaft 1 way. Note the index mark you made before. Put the timing belt back on.
5. Rotate the engine 90 degrees back to TDC, remove the timing belt, and reinstall it the right way. Unless the timing belt was just changed, I'd also change the timing belt while you're in there. However, it's completely possible to slip the belt off with the motor mount still on.

I'll rewrite that part to make it more clear.
I've heard the old timing belt cannot be reused and put back on after taking it off and needs to be replaced with a new one always. What do you think?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,902 Posts
I've heard the old timing belt cannot be reused and put back on after taking it off and needs to be replaced with a new one always. What do you think?
As long as it's not unusually stressed and put back in the same direction of rotation, you can. The manual says you can too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
26 Posts
As long as it's not unusually stressed and put back in the same direction of rotation, you can. The manual says you can too.
How about the belt elongatining with time? As I see, it might be risky to put such an elongated belt back and tighten it following the original procedure, since the elongated belt tension will be lower than it should, and consequently the cam- and crankshaft might go off sync. Please correct me if I am mistaken.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,902 Posts
When you tighten the tensioner will take up any slack in a very slightly stretched belt and reset the belt position, the relationship between crank, cam, and other things is also reset.

An old belt will slightly go out of time because of belt stretch as well. It's possible to loosen and reset the belt tensioner but it's best to not disturb it after a long rest because they can get a little sticky. If you loosen it and retighten it, loosen it all the way before tightening it and repeat once or twice to "exercise" the springs in case they are sticking slightly. In addition, you'd have to reset the other timing belt points and it's more trouble than it's worth.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
Instructions are the same for any single overhead cam PD engine.

I've tried both removing the tandem pump and not removing the tandem pump. Not removing the pump will make life easier and there'll be less mess from the fuel spill. Diesel fuel eats rubber and asphalt. However, it requires moving the camshaft and crankshaft away from TDC. To answer your question, the camshaft rotates once for every two rotations of the crankshaft so you can't rotate each 90 degrees or you'll find that it'll jamb.

Details and pictures are in the camshaft replacement article: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/camshaft-inspection-replace-VW-TDI.htm but basically, the advanced method of replacing a worn PD TDI camshaft is to:
1. put the engine at TDC. You can remove the fuel injector rockers now or later, doesn't make a difference.
2. Move the camshaft 90 degrees with belt on. The slot is now vertical. You can make a mark on the sprocket showing up, or make some general index mark to get the sprocket back on the same direction. This is not an acceptable final position for the timing belt, it's just to get the belt back on.
3. Remove the timing belt and replace the camshaft.
4. The sprocket has a key so it'll only go on the camshaft 1 way. Note the index mark you made before. Put the timing belt back on.
5. Rotate the engine 90 degrees back to TDC, remove the timing belt, and reinstall it the right way. Unless the timing belt was just changed, I'd also change the timing belt while you're in there. However, it's completely possible to slip the belt off with the motor mount still on.

I'll rewrite that part to make it more clear.
Hi Can you post me a link to the DIY section for the above.
Also and excuse me if i'm being dumb here, after you rotate the engine back from TDC you say mark the cam sprocket, then remove the belt. do you loosen the belt tensioner to remove the belt at this stage? Also do you need to mark the crank sprocket as surely this could move as it is not locked down.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,902 Posts
Hi Can you post me a link to the DIY section for the above.
Also and excuse me if i'm being dumb here, after you rotate the engine back from TDC you say mark the cam sprocket, then remove the belt. do you loosen the belt tensioner to remove the belt at this stage? Also do you need to mark the crank sprocket as surely this could move as it is not locked down.
Look at the top of the forum, the Wiki and FAQ section, then look for your model generation or something that is similar. The tensioner should be tightened whenever the engine's camshaft is in place and you're rotating the engine. Detailed instructions are in the article.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top