Turbo and Engine blown - Keep or Scrap? What would you do?

Discussion in 'Mk7 VW Golf, Sportwagen and Audi A3 TDI forums' started by GroovyOne, Mar 26, 2016.

  1. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    Car:
    2009 VW Jetta SW TDI
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    Houston, TX
    So here is my dilemma. I have a 2009 Jetta Sportwagon TDI that until mile 97,447 had run really perfectly its entire life. The only thing I had to deal with, other than a leaky sunroof, was the P2015 which was easily remedied with the DieselGeek fix. At 97,477 I lost power and coasted the car to a stop, tried to start it again but no luck. Friends behind me saw a spray from the engine bay that ended up being diesel, so I figured the fuel system had depressurized. Free VW Roadside assistance got it to the local dealer.

    They claim the turbo failed, flooded the intake and cylinders, and they claim it trashed the entire engine. Total repair bill by their estimate is $8907. The sales manager said he'd help me out, but that ended up offering me "maybe $500" for the car and a deal on a new or used VW. Shocking I know.

    I am likely going to tow it up to the North side of Houston to Das Autohaus to have them take a look. Their off the cuff "worst case" everything needs to be replaced quote is $9800, but I suspect it will be less than what the dealer quoted.

    Thanks to the whole diesel scandal, the KBB value of the car is about $5600.

    So I am torn. I really don't like the idea of abandoning the car when the rest of it seems good, but paying almost 50% OVER the value of the car to get it out on the road again hurts, even with a 1 year engine warranty.

    So, if this happened to your TDI, what would you do?
     
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  2. Clarke

    Clarke New Member

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    I would fix it myself and keep it only because its a TDI and it German engineering. I absolutely love the TDI and I strongly believe in their engineering... always have; so no I would not get rid of it. That repair bill is about ...at least 60% I assume to be all labour. Someone else I know will know better.
    They are going to fix it at a fraction of what they quoted you ( I know they have to make money) and turn around and sell it for a huge profit. USED cars are more valuable right now in this market than they ever have been. You have many options here and one option is that its going to cost you. So you have to ask yourself do you really like the car and want to stick with the TDI and do you have enough resources to do the rebuild yourself then thats what I would do. If you don't have the immediate monetary side of the equation and don't have the necessary space and or storage area while your rebuilding the worlds finest diesel engine then I would look at finding and shopping around for a non-dealer mechanic shop, ( that offers a min 1 year warranty). But the one option of the dealer giving you $500.00 for the car is an insult to you. Best of luck to you and please keep us posted on your outcome keeping in mind no one should fault you for your decision. Its your car and your money and I respect that. By the way there are a ton of how to do it on youtube and many gracious members in this forum that would give advice just remember pictures speak loudly when trying to describe something in need of help. But again I would do the rebuild either by private mech or myself if the rest of the car is in awesome shape.
     
  3. chittychittybangbang

    chittychittybangbang Administrator

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    If it really is an engine, go on ebay and price used engines. You'd be surprised how easy it is to just swap the whole thing out, and cheap too. You just need a new turbo, used engine, and a set of tools, and a cherry picker. Put a new timing belt on it while the engine is out, you're good to go.

    Also, why would diesel spray out if the intake was flooded? And exactly what was trashed? If the dealer already diagnosed it, they should be able to tell you EXACTLY what is trashed. And it's pretty insulting that they'd offer you $500 when the wheels and parts you can strip in an hour are worth 3x that.

    Give dieselgeek.com a call, he's in San Antonio and may be able to provide some local advice.
     
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  4. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    Agreed on not leaving it with the dealer for sure. I'd donate it before that. The $500 offer was total BS since the transmission alone is worth far more.

    I am fairly certain I am going to get it fixed. I am surprisingly attached to it. If I wasn't swamped with stuff I have to get done before moving, I'd totally consider doing the engine swap myself, or at the very least parting it out myself. I plan on getting my hands on their full assessment tomorrow, especially since I am stuck paying $120 or whatever for the diagnosis. I will be sure to post an update.
     
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  5. Clarke

    Clarke New Member

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    You got me thinking about this and correct me if Im wrong for your model year. If there is an issue with the turbo i.e. carbon build up and or rust would not the turbo shut itself down and create the limp mode thus protecting the engine and all its other components? If so you possible have a couple ways to find out if its just the turbo or the value on the side that controls the operation of the turbo. This might be much cheaper to fix than you think. I'd take that turbo off or drop the exhaust side and see how bad it is. There are rebuild kits for turbo's that are very simple to do with a steady hand and making sure you note each and every step with video and or photos make sure it goes back exactly the way it should. A complete engine failure from turbo failure seems illogical if the turbo is designed to protect the engine...then again I'am learning too.
     
  6. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    It did go into limp mode, but the wrecker driver tried to start it, it ran briefly then there was a loud thunk. I am hoping it is as you described, which would make the most sense. I am hopeful the shop I am takin it to will agree.

    The dealer is claiming the turbo failed catastrophically and flooded the engine with oil.
     
  7. Clarke

    Clarke New Member

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    tow truck driver....ughhhhhhhhhh. Well Im keeping my fingers crossed for you.
     
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  8. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    I called VW of America and they've opened a case. Just to get some more attention to the case I also posted to them on FB. Please like it if you are willing:
    https://www.facebook.com/VW/posts/10156777672775790?__mref=message_bubble

    The Passat got a warranty extension to 100k miles, so maybe they'll do the same. Apparently the dealer has a second vehicle with the same claimed failure.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2016
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  9. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    Update for those following along, the dealer called me this afternoon saying they were working with VWoA and providing information. They expected to get them all the information by tomorrow morning. Hopefully they send the car's entire service history since ALL the recommended maintenance as well as the sunroof work was done there. I was told by VWoA to expect a call by COB today, but I was hoping for more of a resolution. They are working on it though, so that is progress, hopefully good progress.
     
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  10. Clarke

    Clarke New Member

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  11. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    Update for Wednesday, I talked to Cory at VWoA and they have offered to cover half the repair cost, which is substantial. I spoke with the dealer and gave the go ahead on the work.

    So, in under 2 weeks or so, I should have a 97k+ mile VW with a brand new engine and turbo. Hopefully it will go at least another 97k miles!

    For a 97k+ mile car, the failure is still disappointing, but the offer still is a huge help. I would have liked to take it to the guys at Das Autohaus to get the full explanation of what happened, but just under $5k for the new engine, turbo and all related parts is not bad. I am also on a tight schedule since I am moving in about 3 weeks, and they should have it done in under 2.
     
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  12. Clarke

    Clarke New Member

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    sounds great
     
  13. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    Now they claim the entire EGR system is screwed too.

    Total repair bill without VWoA assistance is staggeringly over $15,000 on a car I paid $28,000 for 7 years ago.

    $15,000 repair bill on a car worth about $6,000 thanks to VW diesel mess and due to a failed $900 turbo??

    I have not been able to check out the damage myself since I work on the opposite side of town, and by the time I get down here it is late.


    Car drove all the way to where our carpool meets up from the North side of Houston, 56+ miles, no problem. I pull out of the parking lot, without having turned the car off, and it goes into safe mode.

    1) Coasted to a stop in safe mode.
    2) Called VW Roadside Assistance
    3) Attempt to start car after it sat for 10+minutes, car idles then smoothly dies
    4) Tow truck driver attempts to start car after it sat for 30+ minutes, idles the dies with a mild thud
    5) Dropped off at VW
    6) ???
    7) Expecting phonecall with failed fuel line or something, get blown turbo and engine?!?
    8) VWoA agrees to pay 1/2, work is started
    9) VW dealer calls claiming entire EGR system is shot, $15k total bill, no idea what VWoA will cover
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2016
  14. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Active Member

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    This is what is referred to in the industry as "Totaled"...cost more to fix than it's worth. Walk away from it and buy a Toyota or Honda. Not a popular opinion here, but being a career Mechanic myself, I put safety, high reliability and low TCO first when it comes to mine...and especially my families transportation. YMMV.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2016
  15. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    And if I had actually hit something with it, insurance would have been of some help and I'd get something for it. Moral of the story seems to be to make sure to crash your car if it is a TDI and goes into safe mode.
     
  16. frodoz737

    frodoz737 Active Member

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    There's an old saying..."Screw me once, shame on you...screw me twice, shame on me." YMMV
     
  17. Ol'Rattler

    Ol'Rattler Well-Known Member

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    Sounds real fishy to me. The turbo has nothing to do with fuel. There is no way a failed turbo would cause fuel to spray underneath the hood and flood the intake and cylinders with fuel. Just wow!!! That is just beyond ridiculous.

    Sure sounds like after they are done hosing you they will make more serious cash by "disposing" of your engine for you by selling it to the next victim or even better, fixing the actual problem and then just charging you for a new engine. Unless you had a runaway or the engine hydrolocked both of which are possible from a blown turbo seal/failed turbo bearing.

    Das Auto would have gotten you back on the road for under $2000. That is if the turbo is actually blown. From the symptoms you describe, it doesn't really sound like a turbo problem. When a turbo fails, it is because the turbo oil seal/bearing fails and lets engine oil get sucked into the engine and/or the compressor grenades and throws shrapnel into your intercooler.

    Seems more likely your problem is a fuel leak like you original thought.

    What a business model. Fix a customers car for maybe $200 and then bill him $15,000. I'm just floored by your experience. Get your car out of there as soon as can.................
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2016
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  18. GroovyOne

    GroovyOne New Member

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    So, looks like I have to say the dealer is right on this one. Saw the car today with the engine pulled. I won the bizzare turbo failure lottery. I'll see if I can post the photos I took.

    The service guy misspoke when he said the EGR system. It is the exhaust system, which on this car being a CBEA 2009 is all one big stupid expensive piece, and had oil in the whole system.

    The turbo is totally boned, with broken fins that may have been flushed into the motor. Glow plugs out of the cylinders and excess oil drained, crankshaft won't budge.
     
  19. chittychittybangbang

    chittychittybangbang Administrator

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    The intercooler is downstream of the turbo and usually catches any metal bits since metal is heavy and doesn't like to move through the fins. It can happen but my guess is that the engine failed and took out the turbo, not vice versa. Either way, it seems you do need a new turbo!

    To post pics: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/threads/how-to-upload-and-post-pictures-videos-or-attach-files.617/

    Ah, Ol'Rattler's explanation makes more sense b/c of why you can't turn the engine over.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2016
  20. Ol'Rattler

    Ol'Rattler Well-Known Member

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    I must apologize for being so harsh on your dealer then.
    It makes sense now. My guess is that when the turbo blew, a bunch of oil got sucked into the intake and then hydrolocked the engine which bent some con rods. Perhaps some rods were severely bent. That could explain why it the engine cant be turned over.
     

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