Michelin Pilot Super Sport

[Daniel L]

Has anyone switched to these tires? They're surprisingly available for the OEM wheel/tire size and are reasonably priced for pretty much the best street tires currently available.

[chittychittybangbang]

For a Porsche Cayman S, I would get them. For a TDI, I wouldn't pay the premium since the rest of the suspension won't match it. You'll be overtire-d They are excellent premium performance street tires but I feel it would be a waste of money except on a sports car.

[Pathy01]

I'm not sure about tires in relation to the TDI, but I've always found in better to be "overtired" with previous cars. I'd rather be able to let the suspension do all it's capable of, rather than run out of tire grip first. My most recent experience being with my 335i that had an M3 suspension conversion along with Koni/Swift coilovers and 245/275 Conti DW tires and the handling was phenomenal. Changing only the wheels/tires back to stock 225 all seasons completely killed the majority of the handling prowess. So at least from my recent experience, I'd say put the best tires you can on it. It's not a super sporty suspension on the TDI, but I think it's definitely good enough to make use of better rubber and being in LA, you can use summer tires all year rather than a compromised all season that doesn't really excel at anything.

[chittychittybangbang]

Ok, I take it back since Pathy01 is right, they aren't a waste of money except on sports cars, I really mean they are a waste of money on a standard TDI. Cheaper tires (cheap vs. michelin's top of the line sports tire) will max out the suspension on a TDI for my driving style so I would personally go with a more comfortable and quiet tire since my TDI doesn't have the cup edition suspension, aftermarket sport suspension, and is used for mostly driving long distances.

[Daniel L]

They're actually less expensive than some OEM tires currently, Maybe Michelin is pricing them to promote sales of their new tire design? I'm curious how they compare to less sporty tires in regards to noise and comfort. Supposedly they're quiet but in comparison to what?

I will be picking up a Golf soon and am contemplating putting these tires on immediately, especially after reading complaints about the OEM tires.

[ToeBall]

I don't know how you can be over tired. I'm running 255's on an upgraded suspension and I don't think I'm over tired. Then again the 255 was because I went with low rolling resistance tires. What's wrong with driving a station wagon that bumps on 1g lateral?

I don't think good performance tires are a waste of money. First the CR20 produces lots of torque, so the extra traction helps on launch. Next, it comes with excellent brakes, so better stopping (even with the 255's my ABS kicks on for hard stops at freeway speed). Finally, while cornering won't see as big of an improvement with just a tire upgrade compared to retuning the suspension to match, tires are the one biggest improvement you can make to cornering. I ran Bridgestone RE050 Pole Positions on my car before going with my current setup and was really amazed at the improvement in the car from a tire upgrade. Granted I went from a set of OEM Hankooks so a melted fudge popsicle could have been a traction improvement.

[Pathy01]

Not sure on the noise & comfort levels of the Michelin PSS but there are extreme performance summer tires with excellent levels of both. I've had Conti Extreme DW tires on my JCW MINI & BMW 335i and they were very quiet and comfortable. Even with 245/35/19 & 275/30/19 tires, they rode better, were quieter and more comfortable than the stock 225/45/17 (albeit runflat) tires on the 335i. Treadwear is also better than most similar performing tires. Conti really stepped it up and outperformed the Michelin PS2, which is now being replaced by the PSS so I'll bet the new Michelins are just as good if not better. I would say the Michelins most likely have a little harder ride as they tend to favor a very stiff sidewall for turn in response on a track vs. the Conti being designed more as an everyday street tire that can perform just about as well on a track.

[rotts4u]

I have the Conti DWS on a BMW 135i and really like them. Great wear, great handling and so far good wear. I will strongly consider them when my Jetta TDI needs tires. Talk to Gil at Tirerack he is a PRO at helping you pick tires. I ordered mine from there and it turned out well.

[anthros]

Yep--I've got 'em, and I like them very much. We fitted Pilot Super Sports in the 17-inch stock size (225/45) to the front only.

I have iconoclastic ideas about tires; I consider sticky tires to be cheap insurance. Prior to buying our JSW, we had only one car: a Mini Cooper S JCW with Bridgestone RE-11 tires. They're outstanding, and they wear well despite a treadwear rating of 180. The RE-11s also stuck like glue when I had to dodge a driver who pulled out without looking. It was a close call--it felt like inches, but was probably more like 3-5 feet. I believe I would have hit the other car if I were running the stock Mini tires.

When I read about the new PSS, it promised to approach RE-11 levels of dry grip; it might even exceed the RE-11's wet grip. What's more, the PSS has a treadwear rating of 300, which is surprisingly close to the JSW stock rubber: Continental ProContacts with a treadwear rating of 400.

I convinced my wife that we should buy the PSSes for the front (~$180 each at the Tire Rack) but we were tight on money, so we skipped the rears. I've done this before on other cars and have been happy with the results; I'm happy with this setup as well. In a perfect world, we'd have a PSS at each corner, but this is a pretty good tradeoff for us.

There are some who would wag their fingers at unmatched tire pairs, but those people should hold their fire. The JSW understeers considerably less than it did without the PSSes installed. Even when I turn off the traction/stability control, I still have to abuse the car (trail braking and drop throttle, plus jerky steering wheel inputs) to get any significant oversteer. With the traction/stability control on, I can't get *any* oversteer.

With sticky tires on the front, we get vastly reduced braking distances (especially in the wet), much higher limits for transient maneuvers and better balance in sweeping turns. In short, we get about 90% of the benefit for 50% of the cost. We live in Arizona, so I plan to run this combination all year round. If we moved back to the Midwest, however, I'd invest in a set of four snow tires (and wheels) to use in the winter.

So I have no qualms about recommending the Pilot Super Sports; they're just fantastic tires at a very good price. I don't recommend installing them in mismatched pairs as we did; that's something I feel comfortable with due to my background and experience (a bit of autocross and a lot of mechanical engineering).

Cheers,

Jason

[Daniel L]

Fantastic post anthros. Did your car follow the highway grooves more after installation of the PSS tires? You could immediately tell the difference in braking/handling?